SHOW NOTES

See the Utah Addiction Centers website, where Amber currently works.

Call the National Substance Abuse Hotline at 1-800-662-4357

Chat with the National Human Trafficking Hotline.

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Join the Victory Club, our community of monthly donors who support the work of the foundation.

Chat 24/7 with the National Sexual Assault Hotline.

TRANSCRIPT

Elizabeth Smart: Hello, and welcome back to everyone to another episode of Smart Talks by the Elizabeth Smart Foundation. I am Elizabeth Smart, and today I am joined by Amber Kehl, who I'm very excited and honored to have on today's podcast. She has her own incredible story of survival and healing, but also moving forward and putting a purpose to the pain that she went through.

So welcome Amber, and thank you for joining us.

Amber Kehl: [00:01:19] Yeah, I'm really excited to be here today. I've listened to several episodes of your podcast and have drawn a lot of inspiration from many of the survivors you've interviewed. They're all so powerful. And I, I really appreciate that, the word that you use, that word purpose, because as survivors, it's imperative for me to be able to put what I went through to use and for the good of humanity, otherwise it's just, it's just a tragedy. I am extremely grateful to tell my story and for your listeners to kind of hear my experience. 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:02:01] Well, it's, it's a pleasure and it's always, I feel like it's always very important for, I mean, all the listeners and all of our guests to realize what a privilege it is to, I mean, to have people like you on here to share their story, because it's not always easy and it can be very scary. And it's very, it's opening yourself up to just this level and degree of vulnerability that a lot of people spend a lifetime trying to armor themselves up so they're not put in that vulnerable position again. So it really is special when we have each of our guests come on to talk about their own personal experiences and stories of survival. It's very special. So thank you. So just beginning, I was wondering if you could kind of give us a description or a feel for what your childhood was like, at least from the outside looking in and then kind of walk me through your story a little bit.

Amber Kehl: [00:02:59] Sure. So I've always been kind of rooted in very strong female relationships in my family. I have my mother who is my biggest supporter and my grandmother who's like the root of where I draw most of my inspiration from. So very strong female roles in my family. I've never had a strong male role in my family. I never knew my real dad and my stepfather was, he was not a healthy individual. So, outside looking in, it was a very typical middle class family. I know that people started to wonder what was going on with me in particular at a young age. I was, there was a lot of acting out and cries for help in very childish ways. But for the most part, and it appeared to be a very standard, American middle-class experience. 

I, I experienced trauma at a young age and I never, never really got, been able to get down to the details of what happened, but something happened and it affected me. I started using drugs at a really young age. And I quickly learned that those substances were my way out of my trauma and got into a lot of, a lot of trouble very quickly. I mean, I'm talking young, like 12 was the first time I was taken to the hospital for using too many drugs. 

You get lost in the system. I was always asked, you know, by caseworkers and judges and, and therapists, you know, "what's wrong with you? Why are you acting like this?" There was never, no one ever asked me, like, "what happened to you? What is going on? Let's try to try to figure this out." So I internalize this as shame and I was bad. And that, that really kind of set the tone for what I was willing to accept in my life. 

And then, and then some, some additional traumas came in. I had a son pass away and that stepfather passed away and I knew, and my body knew the way out was through substance. So I have struggled with addiction for a long time. I've known periods of sobriety and they've been beautiful. I ended up, you know, getting married and having children and stayed sober for a long time, went to school for social work, worked in the industry at different treatment centers. And then my husband passed away. 

And there's this reoccurring thing that happens in my story where trauma is introduced and I immediately resort to substance for my way out. And and that was because it worked and it worked quickly. But in that brought additional traumas. So obviously using drugs and being around that criminal aspect was further traumatizing. So we're compounding the issue and what I'm willing to take and not take, my boundaries become skewed. 

So I would say things escalated after my husband passed away and I was in an inappropriate relationship. It was fueled with drugs and not much later, it was actually months into that relationship, became the violence. And I mean, a long story short, I found myself in a, in a very violent trafficking situation. Trafficked by multiple people for multiple different reasons, most being money.

And I, you know, accumulated a criminal charge for drug possession and I ended up on probation. And physical injury, I just remember the injuries and, you know, winding up in emergency rooms a couple of times in a month. And, and the ER, doctor being angry at me when he was giving me stitches and telling me that it wasn't going to end.

 And these kinds of, you know, broken bones and all of these things. But I, I had this probation officer who kept trying to give me chances. And if I ever could find her again, I would love it. Her name is Agent Kemp. And she was a woman and she came, I went to go check in and it was some reason why I wasn't doing well and other, you know, excuse us to what, what was wrong with me. And she finally just sat me down and she said, "no one ever gets hurt this much. I know something's going on with you. And I need you to tell me." And I, in that moment it felt like giving up like the story of what I was going through. And I finally just, I told the truth and I said what was happening.

And she immediately jumped into action and got me in touch with detectives and knew that this was going to be a touchy situation. There were, you know, kids involved and the trafficker was in my home. And so we started the investigation and long story short, the trafficker found out and it, that was a very dangerous night. And I lived through that and was able to contact police and they came and arrested him and it was the typical take him to jail, he bails out, he comes back tries to assault me again. And then it was, and then it was pure chaos after that. I thought it was chaos before, but that was the hardest part was stepping into my truth and into the light because I had to address everything that was going on. 

And it was so complex that I was, you know, the police officers are waiting outside of my house and they're protecting me cause he's on the run. Everyone's trying to help me. And they all have this limited scope of what they can do. The prosecutors, the therapists, the detectives, the crime victims reparations, the victims advocate. They all have a very narrow ability and our system is not set up for survivors. So I was in and out of treatment centers and I was high acuity, so I wasn't blending well in primary substance use, but I obviously had a substance abuse problem and quickly spiraled.

And I just, I just kept trying, but there was not anything in place that, of support into what I actually needed and everyone tried and they tried and I just hold law enforcement a special place in my heart for all of those people who helped me out of that situation. And then, and then trial, right? So.. 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:09:47] None of those are easy and I think you absolutely hit the nail on the head when you said this is not a system built for survivors. It's not at all.

Amber Kehl: [00:09:57] It's not. And it's not because they don't want to help. It's, we need more, we need something more. So, and then the criminal charging aspect was absolutely horrific and I plan on maybe doing some lobbying or advocating for that because it's, it's inappropriate, the questions and the hours and hours on the stand and just, you know, these defense attorneys asking. It's retraumatizing, it's inappropriate, it's unnecessary. And the whole objective is to break you and.. 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:10:30] Absolutely. I mean you've had a crime happen. And then, I mean, I see some, I mean, I've had so many victims come to me and say, well, I don't want to go to trial because I didn't live a perfect life. And so I don't want them digging up my past when I'm not up there. Like I'm not being put on trial and my past is not being put on trial, but I don't want to feel like it is. And I, I mean, I've heard that time and time again, and that's exactly what happens. I mean, you get up there, a crime has been committed against you. You're trying to seek justice for that. And instead of feeling like this person's on trial, you end up feeling like you're on trial and whether or not you're worthy to be believed based off of your past, and who you are.

Amber Kehl: [00:11:16] It's excruciating. And this public display while they're doing it is, no wonder that the conviction rate is low and people don't report it. We've got to, we've got to do something about that. It's just wrong. But I mean, I didn't make it through. I made it through preliminary hearing. You know, their only defense is to call me a liar and all of these things. And, and I I immediately gave up after I testified  and I, and I tried to, I tried to die that night and it didn't work.

And, the, the story gets even more complicated. And I, I find myself literally giving up on myself and committing a crime, knowing that, you know, I was on an ankle monitor and they were trying to help. I literally gave up and I, I ended up in prison. And the saddest part about all of this is that's where I thought I would be safe. That was the, my solution to what I was going through was just take me away. And you know, that, that didn't help the situation at all, and it wasn't safe in there as we all can imagine. So it wasn't until I found my God that I knew my way out. And, 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:12:38] do you mind me asking, how did you find? 

Amber Kehl: [00:12:40] Yeah. So I've always known of God. I've known of Jesus. I've known of a spirituality and how people apply it to their lives. Growing up in Utah, it's not something that most kids aren't aware of or educated on. However, I'd never had a relationship or a spiritual experience. 

And this moment is so impactful because I'll never forget it. My way of, of coping with what was going on was to disassociate. And I would, I would do it at will because I could, and I finally started doing it involuntarily. And I remember it was a moment where I was disassociating and I was enjoying it.  And something, i t's not like something I heard, but it almost felt like I heard it. And it was something along the lines of like, "you need to go back." And I, and I kind of woke up from this little like hypnotic state that I was in. And it was these small coincidences that continued to happen over and over and over you know, no church or ecclesiastical leaders had reached out to me while I was in prison, but they did that day. And there was, you know, a message that a girl that ended up losing it, losing her life, but I was really close to her a message she'd given me that, you know, meant nothing to her, but in that moment it meant everything to me. And I just felt like something was trying to communicate with me and I had to explore it.

Elizabeth Smart: [00:14:23] Can I ask what that message was? I mean, is that okay? 

Amber Kehl: [00:14:27] It was very much, her handwriting was absolutely beautiful. And, and she would write me like little, like, you know, crafty little letters and and the note said something along the lines of like, "God hears you" or "God sees you." And it was very, just basic, but beautifully written with lots of little, you know, stars and stuff around it. And it, it was just shocking to me cause we'd never really had a conversation about like God or what I interpreted God to be like, or if we had similar beliefs. So it's just, you know, several of these things that just kept happening over and over and over in that day. And I finally just surrendered my idea of that I didn't have a relationship with God. And still to this day, the most beautiful spiritual experiences happen to me all of the time. 

And when I started to acknowledge them is when things started to come a little bit easier. So, you know, in ways of support and other people, and not treading through life in the trenches by myself and with all this trauma and pain and, you know, being mentally ill and all of those like sufferings and, and I've stayed in that solution this entire time. And life has gotten a lot easier and things now just present themselves to me. It, I'm always so shocked. And my family around me is always so shocked because of how many blessings I'm receiving and I know, I know that something much bigger than myself is at play here and I just kind of need to show up.

Elizabeth Smart: [00:16:13] I mean, I've always believed that God doesn't look to punish us. I think that he constantly looks to bless us and it's just whether or not we are open to receiving his blessings or not.  I think he always wants to bless us. So please continue. I just wanted to add that tidbit in. 

Amber Kehl: [00:16:31] Yeah. It's overwhelming. And sometimes I feel unworthy of them because of my past.

And I see some of my really close friends and even other survivors who are struggling through this so much. And, and I haven't really had that. So there's a part of me that, you know doesn't understand. And I guess I'm not meant to, but it, there was that moment where I knew that things are starting to happen and spiritual things that, you know, weird universal, only can move mountains type of things.

And so I accepted it and I made a promise to myself in that cell that they were going to regret that I ever survived. 'Cause when I got out of there, I was going to make some big changes and I was going to come for them. And there was nothing that was going to stop me. Like this is where I'm going to be. And that path has formed for me just naturally. It's just come very naturally. I've put therapy and trauma work ahead of everything in my life. It has to be a priority and it ebs and flows, but it is still my, my biggest, the only thing I need to do is make sure that I'm taken care of so I can take care of everything else.

Elizabeth Smart: [00:17:51] And I think that is such an important point, actually. You can't expect to help other people if you're not in a place yourself. I mean, I'm sure most of us are familiar with like the cup of water. How can you give water if you don't have any water inside of you already?. So I think that is so important and I actually wish that more people understood that and took it a little bit more seriously.

And especially those people who are around survivors or parents of children who have been victimized, I wish they understood that as well. That for you to help them, you need to make sure you are in a healthy place yourself. Because if you're not, you won't be able to help them and you might be their only lifeline to moving forward to healing.

So I'm, I'm so happy you brought that point up. 

Amber Kehl: [00:18:39] Yeah. It's definitely something I've not done before. Right. And everything I have in my life is so sacred to me now. That I know it's deeply rooted in something far bigger than myself. It's very spiritual and this work that I'm doing now, I hold very, very sacred. And this position is not for the faint of heart by any means. So,

Elizabeth Smart: [00:19:07] And tell me a little bit about the work that you're doing now. You are working with Utah Addiction Center. Is that, that's correct?

Amber Kehl: [00:19:15] Yeah. I do their outreach and marketing. Utah Addiction Centers is primary mental health. They specialize in trauma. They've treated some operators in the past. So we have similar passions about anti-trafficking and kind of being in this fight and figuring out all the layers of what aftercare and treatment looks like. There is a couple of pieces that are important and that I can support in that being trauma and addiction and mental health is not just like one thing.

And it's got to be very flexible and it's very like fluid treatment of how, how people heal and Utah Addiction Centers is that facility. And I love what they're doing. And outside of Utah Addiction Centers, I've had a lot of run-ins with different organizations locally, and even some nationally, some I've enjoyed the relationship and I enjoyed their vision, it's just not my path. So I've kind of weaved in and out of what's happening in Salt Lake non-profits, you know, street-level outreaches different things. I am, my passion lies in aftercare for survivors and apprehension. So 

I am back in school for ethical hacking programming. I know, it sounds like a ridiculous thing to say. When I say it out loud, I'm just like, what are you even saying? But I just know that I know that this is where I'm going to be. I know it's where I'm supposed to be. And it's where my passion lies. I definitely want to, you know, internet crimes, I definitely want to be on apprehension investigation rescue.

It may not be for actual law enforcement given, you know, my past and some of the things that follow me along on my record, but I definitely see some, you know, non-profit work or I don't know what it's going to look like. I just know that's, that's where I belong. 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:21:17] I mean, whatever your pathway is forward. I think that because of your past, that it'll make you all the more passionate and a stronger. Because you have been there and you have walked that walk and you understand it, and you have a greater compassion and understanding about it than maybe someone who has only read about it in a textbook or who has only had minimal experience with it minimal to no experience with it in their life.

And I think that's honestly why survivors, well, really anyone, whatever you find your pathway in life, if you have personal experience with it already, it's always going to make you that much more sensitive and aware and compassionate and passionate about the project. If you have that in your own, if you've already had that in your own life.

I mean, as much as I'd like to think that I would care as deeply as I do about fighting sexual abuse and rape and exploitation and the different various forms that it's coming, as much as I'd like to think that I was, I would care as deeply as I do the truth is had I not been kidnapped, had I not been raped, had I not been abused in the way that I was abused, I just, I don't know that I would. I don't know that I would have that level of, of passion and empathy and purpose in my life, and, and beyond that, I don't know that people would listen to me, either. I mean, how much more compelling is it to have someone standing in front of you saying, "well, no, I experienced this so I know. And I can tell you" versus, well, "I read about it. I follow these podcasts or I, you know, like I listened to these speakers speak about it. So I feel pretty confident in saying," I mean, it's always going to be more meaningful when you've experienced it yourself and when you have that passion from within. So I think wherever you end up, you'll, you'll be incredible. 

Amber Kehl: [00:23:19] Thank you. I am totally thrilled about it. And I know that, you know, I've got, I've got a big God behind me today and I'm just excited to see what the, what the future holds. And I, I definitely can relate with you on the level of this very fine tuned ability to reach back in and grab our people out, you know, it comes fairly easy for me to, to connect with people who have suffered any form of, you know, abuse. It seems far easier for that connection piece to happen and I'm, I'm grateful for it. And I'm, I know it's sacred because I know, you know, years and years in my life where I, I felt so unheard and not seen and that no one would be able to understand what I was saying and, and what, what I was experiencing, was it really as bad as I thought it was like, there was much confusion on what was happening to me.

So it's a gift. And I, I can see my personality type, you know, kind of signing up for this life if it meant that I got to help the many on the backend and I, I would do it all over again.

Elizabeth Smart: [00:24:42] I mean, I have had similar feelings in that. Not that I would ever wish to be kidnapped again or hurt again, the way that I was, but with everything said and done and looking at where I am today, I'm not sorry that it happened to me either because of where it's led me. And because of the path it's put me on that I probably wouldn't otherwise be on. And for the platform that it gave me that I truthfully probably wouldn't have either. And so, I mean, I can definitely agree with you on it. I would, I don't want to go through it again. I hope I never have to go through it again. I hope my children never go through it, but I'm grateful for the opportunities and the understanding and passion and compassion that it has given me.

Amber Kehl: [00:25:33] I'd never thought I would feel that way, you know, because it's been years of trying to heal from this, but now that I feel strong in what I'm doing now. It's definitely put me in this space that I was never in before and having a relationship with a power much bigger than me, that that knows my wants. And what I need from this planet, as I cherish it. So, and I don't know if I've ever gotten there, had it not been for a spiritual experience in a prison.

Elizabeth Smart: [00:26:07] And I agree with you that as well, because you know, my captors, they tried to use, they'd twist religion so much that it was unrecognizable, but that's how they tried to justify everything they did.

And I used to be asked all the time, "well, how can you still believe in God when they basically did everything they did in the name of God to me." And I mean, kind of going along with what you were saying earlier, isn't it much more comforting to believe that there is an all powerful Being, an all powerful, omnipotent God who is aware of me and who is on my side and who hasn't forsaken or abandoned me than to believe that I am completely alone in this situation.

I mean, that is a much more terrifying thought, a much more comforting thought to believe. It is a much more comforting thought to believe that that there is a powerful God who is aware of me and loves me and is there for me then to think that I'm completely alone.

I mean, that is the same belief that I held on to during my own captivity. 

Amber Kehl: [00:27:14] Yeah, it's, it's exciting.  I'm grateful for it and I wouldn't give it up for anything. 

Elizabeth Smart: [00:27:20] Well, Amber, thank you so much for sharing your story today. Thank you for your time. And once again, for, you know, really putting a purpose to, to your pain, I mean, to not just allowing it to destroy you, but to allow it to fuel you and inspire you and to help work to create change for, for other victims so that they have a better experience and hopefully to help prevent these crimes from happening. So thank you so much.

 And to everyone who's listening, watch Amber, because she is going to make waves. I have no doubt and she's just been so incredible and lovely. And just because a person has maybe a, a record, it does not define them at all. I mean, you just never know what a person has been through that put them in that situation and why things happen the way they do.

But I certainly know that Amber is working and making change in this world in a way that we desperately need. So thank you to everyone for tuning in to this episode. Thank you Amber so much. If you have a chance, please give us a rating. Please leave us a review and make sure to catch us next time on our next episode.

See you soon.